[routesecondaire]

I've got exactly the same issue but I haven't done anything yet about it. Thanks very much for all the details.

 

[rantingsmith]

Update:

It has been a couple of weeks or so, since I’ve got my car back from the garage having had the Adieu Blue procedure done on it. they also removed the DPF filter. After that they had to re-tune the car, so I got a stage one tune in the price too.

Lets go with the negs first:
Cost was around £560 in the end, included initial diagnostic then return visit for work to be carried out and cutting open DPF housing on exhaust, removal and re welding. All future MOTs will need to be carried out by sympathetic garage..

Throttle a little hesitant off tick over.

Positive throttle engagement makes it feel like a hot hatch, not a highly economical diesel and fuel economy dropped to the low 50’s for the first tank of fuel

Pluses:

Hot hatch throttle response.

No more add blue warning, engine warning or countdown and never again for these systems.

Been seeing better mpg figures on the second tank than I ever have. Since last fill up I’ve just done around 65 miles and gotten 70mpg average! Before my best commute average ever had been 64.1..

edit: forgot to add system seems to boot up a little quicker on startup. possibly as it is not trying to work out what to do about all the fault readings.

Conclusion: I’m going to stick with the car for now as economy was one of the big factors for picking this model, as was my previous experience with the hdi engine.

Would I recommend it? Look at the pros and cons and make up your mind. Work out why you have ended up with this car and would you be happy going this route or the Citroen approved/recommended..?

Hope this helps people work out ways forward, also have a looks at the posts from CactiBhoy who put me onto the write it out of the software and have it disconnected route though he’s still got the filter in the pipe so is potentially not going to need a friendly garage for his MOTs..

cheers,

Rant

 

[thetapeworm]

Thanks for taking the time to write that up @rantingsmith - a nicely balanced summary that will hopefully help people in the future.

 

[rantingsmith]

Thanks for taking the time to write that up @rantingsmith - a nicely balanced summary that will hopefully help people in the future.

I would not have solved my AdBlue and engine warning issues if it wasn't of this thread you set up and have moderated for all of it's nearing 200 posts. It is a very obvious and prvalent problem if you look at the amount of other threads relating in essence to the same issue, there seem to also be countless threads and questions on other model forums from the PSA brands relating to AdBlue issues. It seems an unfortunately flawed system on what is otherwise quite a good engine and it spoils a number of cars/ models prematurely for people.

I am just glad it is one issue I will no longer have to face with mine and I did not have to go the unfortunate route of selling it/passing the buck.

Thank you for creating and moderating this thread. It should be a sticky on the homepage for the forum as there seem to be quite the number of others relating to one or other of the symptoms of the same issue.

ps: touchscreen system boot up is definitely a little quicker now it no longer has to deal with checking the response for the slew of error codes thrown up by the pump and sensors.

 

[Lucymac1982]

Thanks for posting this helpful advice. I've got the same issue, contacted the 0800 number and they've booked it in at Redditch Citroen dealership in July. The 0800 number said they're aware it's a common fault but my repair will not be FOC on my 2017 Citroen C4 cactus 😳 I just hope and prey it's no where near the £1000+ that you've all quoted.

I'll pop back and keep you posted.

 

[thetapeworm]

Thanks for posting this helpful advice. I've got the same issue, contacted the 0800 number and they've booked it in at Redditch Citroen dealership in July. The 0800 number said they're aware it's a common fault but my repair will not be FOC on my 2017 Citroen C4 cactus 😳 I just hope and prey it's no where near the £1000+ that you've all quoted.

I'll pop back and keep you posted.

Sorry to hear you've joined the rest of us with this one, it's a pretty unpleasant experience.

A few people have now opted to just go to an independent diagnostics / mapping place and have the software changed so that all of these systems are disabled, it depends how "pure" you want to keep the car but it can be considerably cheaper than replacing the tank if Citroen won't help with costs. You'll already be looking at £125 for up to one hour of diagnostics before they will even tell you what the issue is (despite it being incredibly common)

Please let us know how you get on and I hope they do the decent thing for you if you stick with the Citroen route.

 

[simonpaulnorth]

Hi all, I have been reading this post all evening, very interesting. My 65 Plate (55k) C4 Grand Picasso has just developed this emissions fault with the fault code being P20E8. I went to see a Citreon specialist (not dealer) today who recommended a new adblue tank at 1300 inc fitting.... whilst stood next to a pile of old adblue tanks he had taken out of other Citreons.

It's unbelievable they don't have to replace these clearly sub standard parts free of charge. Anyway, he suggested resetting and see what happens but it came back within miles with the 700 mile countdown.

Before I decide what to do to resolve I wonder whether anybody can give me advice on the following please: Quality of new genuine Citreon replacement tank - the specialist advised me the new genuine parts are improved to prevent these future issues and he won't fit the older models (cheaper on the internet) or OEM models. Is it really worth me paying nearly twice the price for the latest genuine citreon part?

UREA Injector - would a blocked/ dirty injector give the same fault code I.e. should this be tested first? I've looked at i could take it off and give it a clean... I think.

Thanks all Simon

 

[thetapeworm]

Hi Simon, sorry to hear you've joined the party, it's a pretty busy one it seems.

Like you say it seems completely wrong that the consumers are paying the (substantial) price for what is obviously a defective part due to a design fault or bad components. Citroen and Peugeot know there's an issue, acknowledge what the fault is and have brought out a redesigned part to rectify it (time will tell on that one), they need to take ownership of this an either start supplying the part at cost or better still doing a proper recall of all the affected units to protect their brand image. Yes it'll hurt them financially but more so than losing endless customers?

The latest part is supposed to be "new and improved" - I haven't seen one in person or seen any notes to say what was changed but they say it's happened, it would be incredibly shady if this wasn't the case and they were just supplying newer instances of the same part.

The injectors do get clogged up apparently and I recall seeing a post from a taxi driver that had cleaned one and resolved an issue he had but I'm not sure it was a long-term fix and he ended up needing a tank in the end.

Personally I think I'd code it out now with some hindsight, I wish I'd done ours back when it happened as I now have an EOLYS issue that wouldn't have been a problem as that would have disabled too, the entire emissions system just seems fragile and expensive to maintain / repair and much as I'm all about saving the planet and playing by the rules Citroen turned me slightly.

The extra 30bhp or so is nice too obviously

 

[nc111]

Has anyone found out whether its the whole tank or a smaller part that needs replacing.

I had this a couple of years ago, but inexplicably it went away by itself. It's now back. My mechanic has scanned the codes now I've got the countdown and said it relates to a NOx injector but as that's about £200 wants to have it in and have a look before going any further.

Now £200 is a lot better than £1000+, anyone had that or if it's solved it. Does replacing a whole big plastic tank seem a bit overkill?

Unsure whether to go down the Citroen route, phone a 0800, but then have to pay £144+ just for a Citroen garage to confirm it, before finding out whether it would be covered or whether they'll only discount it. Guess they won't cover labour. Might that £144 be better going towards an independent installation rather than to a lottery of what will be covered?

My car is 8 years, and although I did get an extended warranty initially, that's ran out now.

Remapping sounds interesting, but the having to find a sympathetic MOT place makes me wonder how much of a bind it would be.

 

[thetapeworm]

This is the crux of the issue really, the tank has lots of components on it, some are failing, none are replaceable separately and you need the whole tank with the injectors and sensors even if its just one element that's the issue.

This kind of practice needs to be dealt with across the whole industry, it's so wasteful.

People have done the NoX sensor in the past and it's helped, others have done it only to have to do the tank anyway, it's such a frustrating set of issues.

A remap.woukd he something like £200 - £250 Inc an initial diagnostic, you're nearly at that with the diagnostic alone from Citroën but it depends where you stand ethically to some degree.

 

[KVB]

Has anyone found out whether its the whole tank or a smaller part that needs replacing.

I had this a couple of years ago, but inexplicably it went away by itself. It's now back. My mechanic has scanned the codes now I've got the countdown and said it relates to a NOx injector but as that's about £200 wants to have it in and have a look before going any further.

Now £200 is a lot better than £1000+, anyone had that or if it's solved it. Does replacing a whole big plastic tank seem a bit overkill?

Unsure whether to go down the Citroen route, phone a 0800, but then have to pay £144+ just for a Citroen garage to confirm it, before finding out whether it would be covered or whether they'll only discount it. Guess they won't cover labour. Might that £144 be better going towards an independent installation rather than to a lottery of what will be covered?

My car is 8 years, and although I did get an extended warranty initially, that's ran out now.

Remapping sounds interesting, but the having to find a sympathetic MOT place makes me wonder how much of a bind it would be.

I'd just go and get the whole ad blue system mapped out. That's what i did in the end. Citroen are a joke!

 

[Watsojl]

Thanks for posting this helpful advice. I've got the same issue, contacted the 0800 number and they've booked it in at Redditch Citroen dealership in July. The 0800 number said they're aware it's a common fault but my repair will not be FOC on my 2017 Citroen C4 cactus 😳 I just hope and prey it's no where near the £1000+ that you've all quoted.

I'll pop back and keep you posted.

was there an update, as I am a 2017 cactus as well and got the 1500 miles to go sign.

 

[CactiBhoy]

No garages don't have to be sympathetic. As they don't check that the Adiglu is operating correctly or at all. They look for lights on the dash.

And how much Nco2 is coming out the exhaust. They get approximately twenty minutes to check the system.

Their computer (That's connected to the DVLA live) and their printout. Do that for them.

Their computer does the rest, but for some reason beyond my pay grade if one of the systems did fail, they can

A. Pull the plug and end the test early.

B. Put the exhaust reader in someone elses exhaust (easier with petrol powered cars).

Or, do what they do for most diesels' and just ignore it. As failing one part doesn't mean failure, as the give the engine a good rev out side, before it comes in.

And one with the exhaust tube extractor on Then do the MOT at tickover and a small rev, once the computer has started to read.

And they tap the Adiglu tank with their fist, to see if its got contents, give it and the fuel tank a jiggle, to see how secure they are.

Most of the MOT, is spent hitting steering, brake and chassis components, with a section of small hammers and scraping knives and blunt screwdriver looking handled implements looking for either failure, or failure close to a mounting point.

Most if not all MOT station's are the same.

 

[nc111]

This is the crux of the issue really, the tank has lots of components on it, some are failing, none are replaceable separately and you need the whole tank with the injectors and sensors even if its just one element that's the issue.

This kind of practice needs to be dealt with across the whole industry, it's so wasteful.

People have done the NoX sensor in the past and it's helped, others have done it only to have to do the tank anyway, it's such a frustrating set of issues.

A remap.woukd he something like £200 - £250 Inc an initial diagnostic, you're nearly at that with the diagnostic alone from Citroën but it depends where you stand ethically to some degree.

I'm not raising a case with Citroen if I've to pay £150 for an initial diagnostic before they decide whether to cover or discount (and labour costs from an "authorised garage" to fit a tank would wipe out any discount). It'd probably end up a similar cost to simply getting a tank fitted by an independent.

Ethically Citroen should do a recall on all pre-2019 cactus and replace the tanks FOC, it's a known issue to them. Or at the very least have it that once the car registers the fault to cover replacement if they don't want to replace ones that haven't failed yet. However they aren't. In addition unlike many manufacturers that have a separate tank they've decided to have a massive one with sensors etc built in, so one sensor fails you have to pay for the full thing.

My mechanic has had a look and the wiring comes from the tank to the NOx sensor, so it's all linked, not great.

I think I'll probably go down the remap route (though I've now got an additional 700 miles to think about it), just need to find out what the remap covers (e.g. if it is the NOx will remap work, or still need that doing).

 

[nc111]

I'd just go and get the whole ad blue system mapped out. That's what i did in the end. Citroen are a joke!

How long ago, and how's it been? Did they have to do anything about the DPF too?

Their AdBlue system is designed with control and profit in mind and probably is designed to fail at some point knowing the whole thing has to done at great expense. The change from pre and post 2019 tanks (metal vs plastic parts) probably has little to do with addressing the fault completely and more to do with the fact that they were failing whilst cars were often under warranty so they had to cover the costs.

 

[thetapeworm]

I'm not raising a case with Citroen if I've to pay £150 for an initial diagnostic before they decide whether to cover or discount (and labour costs from an "authorised garage" to fit a tank would wipe out any discount). It'd probably end up a similar cost to simply getting a tank fitted by an independent.

Ethically Citroen should do a recall on all pre-2019 cactus and replace the tanks FOC, it's a known issue to them. Or at the very least have it that once the car registers the fault to cover replacement if they don't want to replace ones that haven't failed yet. However they aren't. In addition unlike many manufacturers that have a separate tank they've decided to have a massive one with sensors etc built in, so one sensor fails you have to pay for the full thing.

My mechanic has had a look and the wiring comes from the tank to the NOx sensor, so it's all linked, not great.

I think I'll probably go down the remap route (though I've now got an additional 700 miles to think about it), just need to find out what the remap covers (e.g. if it is the NOx will remap work, or still need that doing).

The forced diagnostic is a real Catch 22 and given how little help Citroen are willing to offer these days it's becoming more of a gamble, paying for the diagnostic and then getting it back when Citroen covered all the cost was a no-brainer, these days it's an extra bill on top of the rest.

You used to be able to get the tanks cheaper than Citroen quoted (even with a pretend discount) but that seems to have dried up now demand is increasing and even if you do use a trusted independent there's still the chance you'll need Citroen to tell the car it's got a new tank and clear the errors as some systems don't seem to be able to do the full process.

I couldn't agree with you more around the ethics of all of this, it's a known issue amongst Citroen and Peugeot cars with shared components, they need to acknowledge this and stop punishing owners and causing themselves more and more reputational damage. You can almost forgive it on a mega mileage taxi or a van but on a low-mileage (20k) passenger car that's a few years old? Totally unacceptable. The design of it is something that needs some kind of intervention across the whole industry, these systems should be serviceable, not completely replaced in the event of one part having issues.

I'm currently trying to work out the implications of mapping on the DPF, in the old days of decats I'd knock the core out of an OEM one so I have a spare to swap back but even used, clogged up, DPFs are expensive now so that's not viable - mine only has the EOLYS issue currently so it seems overkill to map it all out when I could probably fix this for less but the lure of a bit more oomph also appeals.

Let us know what you end up doing as I feel like this one will run and run as more and more people are impacted.

 

[Lucymac1982]

was there an update, as I am a 2017 cactus as well and got the 1500 miles to go sign.

Took it to Citroen Stellantis and you in Redditch Thursday just gone. Got it back about an hour ago. It was the UREA tank. Citroen said they were not doing it FOC but gave me 60% good will gesture so I paid just over £600 for diagnostic, parts and labour. Kick in the teeth still because it's a known fault to them, but better than the £2k

 

[Lucymac1982]

Took it to Citroen Stellantis and you in Redditch Thursday just gone. Got it back about an hour ago. It was the UREA tank. Citroen said they were not doing it FOC but gave me 60% good will gesture so I paid just over £600 for diagnostic, parts and labour. Kick in the teeth still because it's a known fault to them, but better than the £2k

I was told by them originally there's a 2 month wait for the part. And I could just have the fault code reset and the countdown would start again from 750. But miraculously, they "found a part in stock"

 

[thetapeworm]

Not the result we all want to see but you've done better than a lot of people and when the time comes to sell you can hopefully use the new tank as a selling point.

They need to apply the same levels of goodwill across the whole dealership network, it needs to be consistent.

 

[Kev1mc]

I have had a reply from Citroen today offering 70% off parts covering the tank but not the injector.
Still waiting on Stoneacres of Wrexham to get back to me with full cost but don’t know if it’s worth pursuing for more or if this will be the final offer. Is there any further actions that could be taken. I have a 2016 C4 Cactus on 44,000 miles.

Also needs a catalytic converter which is covered through recall. Not a car person but are all these issues connected?